Skull and Swords

[NUCCRanger07]

I know an alumnus from Norwich (class of 77), and upon looking in his senior year book, i saw in the back in the activities section...the skull and swords.

it strikes me as a little strange that in 1977 the skull and swords was looked at along the same lines as IEEE or another respectable organization.

my question is, when did the skull and swords turn into a "secret" society? and what led up to it?

Thanks

[private2004]

I always wondered that as well, it seems that very few people are willing to talk about the Skulls and Swords or any other organization for that matter. I know that Professor Vanchck and Professor Lord know some stuff....... Also lets start trading things we have heard I will start

1.) That a member of MP company (or just an MP when there was no company) was always in the Skulls and Swords

[MP87]

There were actually always two members of Skull and Swords that were MPs until 1985 when it fell to only one member.
MP87

[private2004]

Thanks MP87!

2.) Does anyone know any special things that the Skull and Sword would do? I know of only two, one is when they would play the batman theme song and run out dressed as batman during a morning formation , also I heard that they would make the clock in front of the chaple only glow with there special numbers at night.
Also does Professor Lord have anything to do with the group?

[NUCCRanger07]

wow, i didnt know about that batman thing, but i think its kinda funny, cuz that happened this year at around halloween time, and i just thought it was someone trying to be funny.

But one thing i heard, was when civilians started moving on to the UP, i heard stories of members of the skull and swords attacking civilians, like running after them with sabers and such.

and last thing, are there really "underground tunnels" under the UP that were used by the secret societies?

[private2004]

I will look into what I can see about the tunnels, but I do know that they do exist, and most of the places you can enter them have been closed off, but I heard rumors, that there are some that no one knows about that still may be possible to get into.

Also.... does anyone know anything about the door(room??) in the chapel that the skulls and swords used to have as a room, it is all locked up now and no one goes in or out, and the rev will not talk about it.

[JoeJoe]

I do not know of any previous Batman stories other than my freshman year. I was at the Wick '92-'96. What I do know is that one guy, who later became a member of skull and swords, but had nothing to do with the skull and swords at the time, dressed up like batman and would run around during "fu<k you fights" which was nothing more than every cadet sticking their head out their window and yelling "F-You" at anyone and everyone and no one.

Then the batman guy got some freshmen to play along with him, and they planned little fight scenes that would mimick fights from the show batman. Other friends of this particular group would blast out music as loud as their stereo would go and it was rather entertaining.

Skull and Swords had nothing to do with it, other than the guy happened to be selected into the skull and swords for his senoir year. The guy (batman guy) passed on the batman suit to a friend who did not get selected into the skull and swords. This particular batman character died out with the second guy.

As far as I would know, any new attempts to bring "batman" back to the UP would be nothing more than coincidence. Two people had the same idea.

As for the skull and swords, I know nothing about what their purpose is/was. They were secret remember?

[dberube]

I was at school for most of the topics in the thread so far (exciting times huh?) so I'll tell you what I know.

I think Skull and Swords lost their official status and was disbanded in the at the end of the '97-'98 year or the '98-'99 school year after some incidents. Back in the day when I was a rook in '93, I had to learn who was in the society as part of my rook knowledge. I just dug up my rook book and there are 3 pages dedicated to them in there. If anyone wants me to, I will post up what it says, but I'll save that until somebdy asks.

A couple posts up, private2004 mentioned Batman. I can confirm what JoeJoe said. Batman was entertainment during f-you fights and put in a couple appearances my freshman year but seemed to have retired after the administration mandated that the majority of cadets will switch companies each year and at the same time put an end to the all-male companies. My sophomore year ('93-'94) was the last year of that.

My freshman year was also the first year of the civilians on the UP, and I don't remember anyone charging at the civvies with a sabre, snowballs on occasion, but sabres no.

-Dennis Berube

[private2004]

Thanks for filling us in on what the whole Batman thing, its very hard to make sure the information you get on campus is correct. dberube I personally would like to see what it says in your rook book!

[dberube]

This came from the "Norwich University Corps of Cadets Handbook 1993-1994" (rook book) starting on page 15 and ending on page 17. I changed some of the formatting, but otherwise the text is the same.
__________

SKULL AND SWORDS

The Skull and Swords is an organization pledged to uphold and enhance the Norwich spirit, traditions, and image. As such it is chartered to:
- Assist fellow cadets in unfortunate circumstances, when those circumstances are outside the purview of the Chain of Command.
- Assist in maintaining the reputation of Norwich University.
- Assist the office of the President in matters he deems appropriate.

In complying with this charter the Skull and Swords will:
- Operate within the established Chain of Command and in accordance with the regulations of the Norwich University Corps of Cadets.
- Have two advisors; one being the Commandant of Cadets, the other being the choice of the membership, to be selected from the extant faculty and/or staff.

Skull and Swords will not be an investigative body concerning Corps matters (unless so directed by the Commandant), and will not have authority to meter out any punishments.

Skull and Swords consists of no less than 6 and no more than 8 members, seniors of Norwich University, selected annually from the junior class. Members are selected by the current membership, which makes it a self-perpetuating organization.

Members of Skull and Swords are selected on the basis of loyalty to Norwich and its traditions. To qualify for membership a cadet:
- Must have demonstrated outstanding traits of honor and unquestionable loyalty to Norwich.
- Must have demonstrated mature judgment, an understanding of young people, and a desire to devote time and energy for the betterment of Norwich University and its body.

To ensure a wide sample of student opinion, to accept and consider their recommendation for membership, Skull and Swords shall meet, in the second semester of each school year but prior to selection of new members, with the following individuals:
- The captains of the following athletic teams:
Football Baseball Lacrosse Wrestling
Basketball Hockey Rugby Track

- The senior representative (the President, if elected) of the following student activities:
WNUB Maroon Key Alpha Kappa Psi

- The Ranking Senior cadet (non-member of Skull and Swords)
- The President, Semper Fidelis Society
- The Commanding Officer, MCW.
- Golden Anchor Society

OPERATIONS

Skull and Swords is able to execute its mission through an existing close relationship with various agencies outside the control of the University.

In the execution of its mission Skull and Swords observes the following guidelines:
- Skull and Swords has no "power," real or implied, within the Chain of Command.
- Skull and Swords will not circumvent the Chain of Command but will concentrate in areas of service not provided by that structure; assist in off-campus matters.
- Skull and Swords will advise cadets in the same manner that any more experienced cadet would advise any less experienced cadet.
- Skull and Swords will seek, by all legitimate means, to uphold the name, reputation and traditions of Norwich University and its Corps of Cadets.
- Each year Skull and Swords will publicly announce its members at a formal parade which begins the Junior Week ceremonies.
- Each year Skull and Swords will address each class at a class meeting to re-state the purpose, capabilities, and procedures of Skull and Swords


COMMAND, CONROL, REPORTING, REVIEW

Skull and Swords is responsible to the Commandant of Norwich University for the execution of the assigned mission.

Skull and Swords shall meet with the President, at least four times each year, at the call of the President, to keep him informed of organizational activities.

___________

The last section finished out with the names of the actual members for the year. I left those out.

- Dennis Berube

[nucc oldcorps]

I beleive the tunnels thing is largely a myth. There are some manhole covers on the UP though that I always wanted to lift and climb down. Was does 572 stand for?

[BL]

The Batman thing is not Skull and swords it just something past down year to year.

['Guest']

Skull and swords was banned in 1997 when they were accused of beating another student (I can't confirm that as I was not at school in 97) I was how ever I was at the university the next year when scandal broke. (Here is some back ground) Skull and Swords traditionally took a class photo for the year book which depicted all that years members standing in a semi circle with drawn sabers pointing down to a skull with the number 572 painted on it. You can see an example in older year books that are still in the library. When the last official class of S&S was banned they clandestinely indoctrinated the next 8 members (much like the night riders which are thought at one point to have been the same group that split decades ago over some issue but it's been romored it was over the first african american to attened the school) who took a class photo. That photo was found during the summer in 1998. Jackman reacted by taking the current members and putting the on a semester on CMC and demoting them to privates. The scandal was even in some news papers as many of the S&S members or famous 8 as they became known where very high in the chain of command ie Cadet Col. ect. Some of the members who were angry with the university left. Others stayed to keep their commission and while others still (the cadets reciving marine corps commissions) lost their chance to become officers all together and were forced to either work off their scholarships by enlisting or paying back the loan.
Their indoctrinate was called the 8 deaths no one really knows what an a prospect would endure, some say one part was for them to be buried alive with only a straw to breath through as thier other comrdads scrampbled to find them, or being hung from a tree, or thrown off the train tussle in to the water bellow, some say being severly beaten was one of the deaths? Again some of that may be purely fantasy.
You can still see there mark on campus in many ways for example they were involved in instituting the honor committee and were often members you'll notice that the honor committee will take off thier rings at trial check the class photos you'll find thire rings are off around the skull, one of their saying marks the entrance Norwich reminding all to "be faithful to the past"
The questions are still out ther what do they mean when they say I'll die with the secret? Who is the Skull? (although I pretty sure it's inocent as that this was a Jackman aproved group for years) What does 572 mean (although it maybe just a chapter number) Do they still network long after graduation and to what goal?
Who knows.

[guy]

I heard 572 may refer to the intials of the person to whom the skull used to be. I heard he was a cadet was killed by accident by other cadets while playing with swords. the cadets there made it go away and thus was born skull and swords.

[xxx]

It's posible that the 572 refers to somthing sinister I tend to doubt the claim it the skull of dead cadet. Acedental death is hard thing to cover up, there would be an investigation ,angry parents ect. and then to keep the skull and flaunt it seems a bit much. You can actually order a real human skull from pepole who have donated thier bodies to science so getting one really isn't hard especally at university. In Actuallity several collegate societies have simillar numbers for exsample Night Riders have a number 192. Skull and bones a group out of Yale (Whom both Senator John Karry and G.W. Bush are members of) has a number of 322 wich has been varified as a chapter number linking them to a secert Society in Germany.
Again all this is speculation